Ep. 14 | Jacqueline Constance: On Breakups, Bars & Being Black Queer in Philly R&B

From getting thrown onto her first talent show stage at age nine by an unyielding mother to navigating the high-stakes music scenes of Philadelphia and Ohio, singer-songwriter Jacqueline Constance joins The Kenlo Show for a raw look at what it means to be tried by fire. In this episode, we explore her days at CAPA high school alongside a young Jazmine Sullivan, how her roots as a classical trombone player structured her ear for production, and the devastating period where she temporarily lost her voice to physical vocal nodules. Jacqueline breaks down going viral on social media, stepping into her identity as a black queer femme, and turning soul-crushing heartbreaks into cathartic therapy on wax.

01:00:06 — The People's Platform: Introducing Philly’s own singer-songwriter, Jacqueline Constance
01:01:11 — Angel in Disguise: Unpacking a life-changing 9-year-old talent show debut and a mother’s intuition
01:03:17 — The Leo Energy: Overcoming early stage fright and learning to feed off the crowd's attention
01:03:47 — Hallways of Greatness: High school life at CAPA and witnessing a young Jazmine Sullivan’s genius
01:05:16 — Long Arms & Long Trombones: Lugging heavy brass instruments on SEPTA buses and reading music signatures
01:06:55 — Auditioning for Vocal Major: Passing the grueling faculty panel and crushing the music theory exam
01:08:44 — The Nexus Point: Discovering Ella Fitzgerald’s "Live in Paris" and falling in love with jazz scatting
01:11:31 — Evoking the Next Mind: The true spiritual goal of high-level creative presentation
01:12:25 — The Wilberforce Shock: Leaving Philadelphia for a ten-hour drive to rural Ohio
01:14:41 — Homegrown in Blackness: Exploring collective cultural roots at an isolated midwest HBCU
01:17:50 — The Birth of "My Soul": Forming an eight-person campus music collective and packing out student venues
01:20:01 — Releasing the First Track: Asking the right questions to turn classical skills into songwriting gold
01:22:34 — The 1-Hour Song Rule: Inside Jacqueline’s home studio and capturing lightning in a bottle
01:25:07 — The 2014 Breakup: Transitioning out of the "Jacqueline Show" era into real adult growth
01:26:30 — Freeing the Femme: Coming out as black, queer, and fluid beyond the cultural status quo
01:27:46 — Targeted by Existence: Challenging white supremacy structures by simply showing up in a room
01:29:12 — Not Everyone's Cup of Tea: Embracing your identity as an acquired glass of Hennessy
01:30:35 — When the Instrument Fails: Battling vocal nodules and surviving eight months of silent rehabilitation
01:32:00 — Back to the Fundamentals: How intensive classical training stepped in to save her musical career
01:33:46 — Drama for the Plot: Separating real life breakups from dramatic writing concepts like "Bitter Girls"
01:34:53 — Leo Tenderness vs. The Growl: How to deliver honesty to a lion without triggering the sun's burn
01:40:52 — The Virgo Balance: Handling opinionated communication with a Mercury-ruled best friend
01:41:22 — Watching "Pose" with Rita: How a random TV night with her mother transformed into full maternal acceptance
01:43:45 — All Bets Are Off: Pouring newfound freedom into raw studio records celebrating women
01:46:34 — Tried by Fucking Fire: Refusing to let recent dark periods derail an intentional spiritual mission
01:50:01 — Philly Mugging at the Gym: Disarming an intense hometown staredown to greet a viral follower
01:52:33 — The Tuesday Breakthrough: Exploding from 5,000 to 11,000 followers and hitting the 200-video mark
01:54:42 — Natural Grit: How the Philly soul template birthed an unforgettable layer of lyrical friction
01:55:57 — The Neo-Soul Home: Melding ostinato bass lines with foundational home-grown rhythms
01:57:51 — The Theater of Kendrick Lamar: Analyzing K.Dot’s conceptual screenwriting approach to hip hop records
02:00:30 — A Dream Session: Imagining a multi-hour conversation inside the studio booth with Kendrick
02:01:22 — Moving Energy Without Hands: Using the studio as a safe, cathartic release for built-up life anger
02:06:02 — Working with Living Legends: Sharing festival bills with King Britt and touring "Lost in Paradigm"
02:09:24 — Pushing Into 2027: Teaming up with producer Chris Cargo to unleash a massive tier of tracks
02:10:37 — What Do You Do Naturally? Bypassing toxic algorithms to stay true to your late-night identity
02:14:45 — Keep, Cut, or Lose Forever: A brutal speed round selecting between Ella, Jill Scott, and Kendrick
02:24:02 — Vindicated Spirit: Looking the yellow chair in the face and knowing the groundwork was right
02:26:05 — Exclusive: Behind-the-scenes snapshot of Jacqueline's soul-crushing new record, "Slip Away"


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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:06

Hey everybody, it's your girl Ken Low back at it again, and welcome back to the People's Platform for the Creative Community. And tonight we have Jacqueline Constance. She is a singer, songwriter, artist, creator, and we are happy to have you tonight, babe. Happy to be here.

SPEAKER_02 0:19

Like I'm ready to, you know, kick it, have a good time, talk a little something. You know what I'm saying? Talk a little shit. It's cool. Just a little talk a little shit. You know what I'm saying? I'm glad to hear to be here for sure. But while we're here, oh, not with the lakes wrong. I see you. Okay. I'm ready. Today was long. You know what I'm saying? I am also in a space of like transitioning through nine to five and things. So that is part of the journey and part of the grind. But like today was a day. But you know, everything's feeling wrong. I'm feeling good. I feel like, you know, everything comes with a learning possibility in it. So I'm happy that I experienced what I needed to today, and it's allowing me to kind of set up to where I need to be on this path. So I can't complain too much. You know what I'm saying? So it was good. It was good. It's good.

SPEAKER_00 1:06

Okay, period. So we're gonna get right into the details. Let's get it. I'm doing, I'm doing. So when you first started singing, you was about seven years old. Yeah, you know what?

SPEAKER_02 1:15

I was about nine years old. Nine years old. And I always knew I could sing, right? Like always did a little like the house, right? Just real cute. Like I can harmonize with the radio, I can mimic singers online. Like I could, I could do that. Like that was a thing. But I didn't really know that, like, knew that was a gift until my mom was like, I see you singing, I'm gonna sign you up for this talent show, and you're gonna do it. Find a song, prepare it. It's in two weeks. And she was serious. She was serious, like she was dead ass serious. I said, Mom, and I'm nine. I'm like, mom, what's moved out? Like, chill out. Like, what are we doing? Like, what's up with you? Like, I was mad too. Like, I think I might have cried, like the whole nine. But she signed me up. I sang, I sang uh uh Brandy's Angel in Disguise. Come on. And that was my first show ever. And I've been performing ever since. So she clearly knew something, and I didn't. But I literally like got the book that night. And I'm like, you know what, mom?

SPEAKER_00 2:21

I know that's right. She ain't that deal.

SPEAKER_02 2:23

She ain't that. She ain't that. And she tells the story every time we go out, she be like, it was me. It was me that put her on her path. It was me. You know moms. Of course, especially that mom. Okay. Shout out to my mother. She looked at me.

SPEAKER_00 2:35

Shout out to the moms, because you know, she'd be like, okay, you need to put some or so on your show.

SPEAKER_02 2:38

Okay. Okay, because they be knowing. They'll be knowing who to add a little sprinkle to. It'd be like her right there. Get it together. Bring her. I'm like, Yes, ma'am. I'm don't get me. Now, while you was on the stage, how were you feeling? Especially at nine. I mean, anything that a nine-year-old would feel, right? Like, so like the nerves, the what the hell am I doing up here? Like, everyone's staring at me. Like, what am I doing? Like, this is weird, but also I'm doing the things that I love. Like, I love to sing at that point. And it was like, oh, this is fun. And after like the first minute of just like nervousness, I'm like, I know.

SPEAKER_00 3:17

You skaty.

SPEAKER_02 3:18

Yeah, this was cool. I'm like, this is cute. And I'm also a Leo, so like attention is like. I'm gonna leave a movement so I get it. Oh, see, I get it. You get it, you get it. So it was like after the nerves wore off, I'm like, everyone's staring at me. Okay, I'm I'm the guru.

SPEAKER_00 3:34

I'm the birthday. Come on.

SPEAKER_02 3:37

Come on. Period. Okay, let's go. Let's keep going. I think I might have kept singing after the like the track stopped, maybe. I think that's how deep I was in it.

SPEAKER_00 3:46

You said, you know, but I'm the I knew it. I knew it then. I'm like, okay, this is cute. I can do this. And speaking of being that guru, we went to Kempa.

SPEAKER_02 3:54

I did go to Kappa.

SPEAKER_00 3:55

Like, with some of our greats, you know. You know, really.

SPEAKER_02 4:00

Yes. So I I did go to school with uh like Jasmine Sullivan. Oh, um, yeah, she's a girl jazz? Yes, so she's a year older than me. So she was in a grade older than me.

SPEAKER_00 4:10

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 4:10

Yeah, how was that experience? First of all, amazing. One two, Jasmine's always been a beast. Like, I feel like people think, I mean, you've seen the archive footage of her like singing at 12. Right, yeah. But she's always been that amazing. But she's always been like super down to earth, super herself, like very much so like Philly John down, right? Okay. So to see her and to like be at school with her, it's like, okay, that's Jasmine. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Like, not realizing that, oh no, she's like, she's gonna be Grammy Award winning. She got like Billboard Chart and singles, she has like albums that are like selling crazy. It's like, oh no, you're like, you're a star. Absolutely. But you come to this high school every day. That's kind of crazy. But like, that's just the nature and the energy of who she is. I love Jasmine Down. Like, she's amazing.

SPEAKER_00 5:01

But you was always surrounded by grace. Like, we're talking about Jasmine Sullivan, but mind you, your journey going into Kekwa, you was trying out for the trombone. I was made you want to go for well that instrument in itself. Like, what made you want to choose that instrument and go for that specifically?

SPEAKER_02 5:16

You know what? I don't even think I chose that instrument. Let me be real. Um, I started playing the trombone when I was in elementary school.

SPEAKER_03 5:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 5:24

And it was one of the last instruments. Like when I went to audition for like the band, and like, you know, it was one of the last instruments that wasn't picked. All the like the cute shit was already taken. So the clarinet was gone, the flute was gone, the violins, all the violins was gone. So it was all like just brass instruments. And like somebody before me got the last trumpet. So I went in and they would talk to me about music, and like you know, I told them I like music, things like that, but they looked at like my arm length, and it's like, well, you have long arms. I think you might be able to play the trombone. I said, What's a trombone? I don't know what that is. But I ended up picking it up, and that's how I started learning like music, like reading music, like you know, pitch and like key and key signatures and things like that. Like, I got some of my roots as far as like music itself through playing the trombone. And it's one of those things that I'm kind of mad that I let go, like in my adult age, but I was just so embarrassed lugging around this like this four-foot-long case on Scepta. Like, you know how embarrassing it is to get on a SEPTA bus with like a four-foot-long trombone case as a as a joint? Right. That's crazy. So I'm like, nah, nah, I'm not doing that. So by the time I got the kappa, instead of auditioning as an instrumental major, I auditioned as a vocal major. So it was like, okay, I'm gonna do something different because I just don't want to be lugging this big instrument around for another four years. And I got in as a vocal major, so you know, and the rest is history.

SPEAKER_00 6:54

How was the audition? Because you can you can sing down, so don't shy away. You know what?

SPEAKER_02 6:58

The audition was interesting because it was also one of those instances where they give you like two weeks to prepare. They tell you that you have the audition, they give you a date, and then you have to prepare a piece, have you know, sheet music ready with you, okay, and you you sing and you sing in front of the faculty, and then you take uh a music theory test test to see where you at and how proficient you are in music theory, and that's how it went. It just so happened that like I think my audition was okay, okay, but I was really proficient in music theory, like I could read music really well because I come from an instrumentalist background. So I think I think that helped me kind of get into Kappa, you know. But you know, Kappa was a time, it was a time. People say it was it like fame, and like it was actually. Like people like dancing on table, singing in the lunch room, like it was. Oh, I was really like it. We was really like that. I don't people might say we're pump fake it. No, when I was there, we was really like that for sure. I'm gonna live forever. Like, okay, I'm gonna learn how to do it. Who was Leroy? We had a few. We had a few, we had a few, okay. We had a couple. I ain't gonna out nobody. You ain't gonna say no names. We gonna say no names. Okay, but we see. But we had a few, we had a but it that was just the diversity of like the arts at that school. Like, you're gonna run into people who are really about their creativity, like it even at that young age, you know what I'm saying? Like, we're all children, right? But like we would stay to at school till like seven, eight o'clock, making sure that we were ready for our shows and performances and concerts. Like, we were that dedicated to the city.

SPEAKER_00 8:31

Oh, discipline, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:32

Like, and I think that's where a lot of like even discipline now comes from. It comes from like being at Kappa, because Kappa did it for sure. It it definitely put some seeds in me for sure.

SPEAKER_00 8:42

And I love how you mentioned your roots as well, how it took you back to um, you know, dealing with instruments, but with your voice, I know that you were very inspired by Stevie Wonder, Elephant Gerald. So, how did those musicians or artists shape you to who you are today?

SPEAKER_02 8:56

Ooh, you know what? I think a lot of especially Elephant Gerald. Now Stevie, Stevie down. But Ella, I think for me, she has a very specific cadence, a very specific way of singing, a very specific way of how she phrases like her notes and how she structures her singing. It's it's a masterclass. And you like the first time I heard her, I ended up finding a 45, um, like a vinyl record at my mom's house that my nana had. And you know, I'm going through the vinyls and just put one on, you know, the record player, and it was her, her live in Paris album. And I'm like, what kind of singing is this? This is the first time I've heard like scattering and like jazz and like the fullness of it. And I'm like, this sounds like this is art. Like, and I've this is art, like this, this is a masterclass. This is how I hope I make people feel when they hear me for the first time. And that even that thought at like 13, 14. I'm like, the excitement, the the ability to be like, oh my God, like what is this? That was my hope of like everyone that hears Jacqueline at some point, Jacqueline Constance at some points gets that reaction. That first reaction I got listening to her. So, like, I studied her for a long time. Like, I wanted to know how she did things. I wanted to know how she approached these records. I wanted to know how she approached her phrasing and how she sung. And like, I just wanted to know everything. And that that led me to like finding all the other jazz artists, which led me to all the RB artists that led me to the 70s music and the 80s music and the soft rock and you know being a kappa led me to the classical music and like the spirituals, and like so it just opened up a new world for me. So, like, she she's my paradox point. She's like um, and for like the Marvel folks that watch all the like comic book stuff, like she was my nexus point. You know what I'm saying? Start tapping down. A little bit, just a scosh, just a scosh.

SPEAKER_00 11:03

But see, you can tell you passionate and that Kappa really like put something in you because you said you went back, like not like, oh, I'm gonna go to Beyonce, no shade, babe, love you down, but like not like you said, oh, your inspiration is somebody that we both may know, but it's somebody that's like from a time we weren't born, our parents weren't born, you know what I'm saying? So how does that feel to know like you're somebody that somebody's passionate about, and you was passion about other people and got inspired by them as well?

SPEAKER_02 11:31

I think that's a good thing. Like you just got that gifted. You know what? I think that's the hope. I think that is the you know, the prayer, right? That is, you know, what a lot of artists hope is that you're able to invoke that same energy, that same feeling, that same push of like, oh my God, what is this? What level of art is this? When someone hears you sing or sees your art or experiences you live or things like that. I I feel like as creatives, like we are all in a space that we want to invoke the next mind to create. And, you know, I hope and pray that, you know, through the music, through the live presentation, through the speech, through the rhetoric, through all of it, that something gets triggered within the next mind that they can start creating for their own right. So that's the goal. And that, you know, that's that's what the artist. I love that. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:25

So boom, we discovered, you know, your voice at a young age, took it to camp. Yeah, now we leave Philly and we go to Wilburforce.

SPEAKER_02 12:32

Yeah, we go to Wilberforce.

SPEAKER_00 12:35

How was that? What was that like leaving Philly? So, you know, we we love Philly then with the joints, the joinettes, the dickheads. You know, we can never leave.

SPEAKER_02 12:44

You know, a fuck out of here, dickhead stays in the spirit, you know what I'm saying? But when I say it was the biggest culture shock I've ever experienced. So for those who don't know, Wilfors is in the middle of Ohio, Central Ohio. It's an hour outside of Columbus, three hours outside of Cleveland, just to give like reference point, right? Um, and that's more north, like more south is an hour outside of Cincinnati. So it's very central. But because it's very central, it's rural all around. Everywhere, okay. Just farmland all around. So by the time I got to Wilforce, um, I was actually planning to go to Westchester. Um, set up, ready to go, paid my deposit for the room, ready. I got a call from the director who's still a mentor friend of mine. His name is Jeremy, Dr. Jeremy Winston now. Um, ended up contacting me. He was like, hey, I've heard you sing, I would love for you to come to Wobbleforce. I'm like, nah, I'm actually good. Thank you though. I think I might have hung up on him the first time. And I think he actually called me back. And he was like, Well, no, I have scholarship money for you. I said, Well, you should have started with that, okay? Um, and I ended up canceling all my plans to go to Westchester and made my way to Wilberforce, like literally, and the starting point, like the starting dates were like so different. So, like Westchester started in the middle of August, Wolfort started at the beginning of August, and he contacted me like mid-July. So I had like two weeks, maybe a week and a half, to like pivot. And like, thankfully, my folks was like, We'll drive you. Oh, it was all they were on board, and it was a 10-hour drive um to get me to school, and that that was an experience too, because we're talking about like the phases of artistry and what we learned, that took you know, part of who I am and part of my journey was definitely home, grown, and raised at Wilberforce. Because it was it was a time. It was a time.

SPEAKER_00 14:41

Tell us about that time. How was it Wilberforce finding yourself, finding your voice, yeah, you know, going through those phases?

SPEAKER_02 14:47

Yeah, you know, being out there, you know, a fresh, a fresh 18, right? It's so far from home, right? Being at college is one thing, but being far from home and 18 and 18 is a totally different thing. And I was also, I was a music major, I was in the choir, you know, you meet new people, you're experiencing new things, but I'm also like in a space of like Kappa where like everyone is so talented and so amazing. But now it's not just Philly. Now it's like, oh no, you're from Detroit. Oh no, you're from Camden. Oh no, you're from Chicago, oh you're from LA. Like some like we're gonna come together, okay. Exactly. So it's like, oh no, like, and we're all coming together, experiencing like new ways of living within this rural area. And also, Wobble Force is also an HBCU, right? Yes, so it's nothing but black people, like it's it's niggas, okay? In the middle of Ohio, it's niggas. So like we're experiencing everything that blackness can hold and uplift for us at this HBCU, but we're also in the middle of Ohio, and that has its own challenges, right? Like, just because we're at HBCU doesn't mean that everything around us is a common race, exactly. So now we're like learning like the microcosm of life, of like, you know, being around your people, right, is like important, but also it's not necessarily always the case. Yeah, and you still have to be safe and you still have to be guarded and you still have to operate and you know in a white suburban structure, you know what I'm saying? So it taught me a lot of the life things, but on the flip side of that, it also taught me a lot of like the art things, of like how blackness shows up in music and art and like you know, being in the choir, being a music major, I learned more about like the spiritual and like learned more about how you know blackness translates into art music. So and it it wasn't just the classical music, it was, you know, it was the gospel, it was, you know, performing mostly black classical performers. It was, you know, it was it was those things. I was like, oh no, my ideas of music need to expand now. You know, my ideas of art need to expand now because my introduction to blackness and my identity within blackness is now starting to shift. So it's like, oh, okay, okay, I see what's happening here. I'm not mad at it. Let's get it, let's get it. So Wobble Force was definitely a time. Um, I pledged a sorority while I was there as well. Um does some theta sorority incorporated, beautiful beta chapters. Shout out to my teams and my pro fros um and my pro-fights. But it taught me a lot. It taught me a lot being out there. It taught me, you know, that our ideas around who we are are structured by multiple things. We're not just one facet of living, we're not just one facet of like experiencing. Like we are a collective, an amalgamation of this world and how we experience it. So it's up to you to experience it in the ways that you need to to be able to grow. So yeah. Okay, yeah, you know what I'm saying? A little life, a little life shit, you know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 17:55

Just a touch. Now you also found a group out there. Well, you and other people found a group called My Souls. So you going through your phases, you know, you experiencing, you know, you you you living. Yeah. How did you run into these other people? And what made y'all come collectively, like eight people come together, yeah and form my soul? You know what?

SPEAKER_02 18:16

I it is a mix of multiple things, but I had um a partner who I was dating at the time, who was also very musical, very like amazing. And he was like, you know what? I want to start this music collective, and you know, I'm being a girlfriend, I'm like, sure, let's do it. Um, and we ended up just getting our friends together and like we started creating music. And it wasn't anything like, oh, we have like super lofty ideas or goals, but it was like, no, we want to turn this into a thing. We want to, you know, turn this into a label. And we ended up, I think, putting out two projects of like music, and like we were the like the campus buzz. Like we were we were everything, and like I remember having like our first concert, and like the concert being packed and everyone singing the music. It was it was like, oh no, it was like one of those moments where like you get the bug, and it was like, I'm so yeah, like, oh shit, this is different.

SPEAKER_01 19:14

I like this, this is nice.

SPEAKER_02 19:16

Um, so Maso was such a time, it was such a fun time because it was it was just creativity, it was innocence, you know, because we're because college is a bubble, it's not really life, right? But it's an experience that like you have and like you're safe on some levels. So like it was just art, it was love, it was friendship, it was community, it was connection. It got a it got tricky, of course, because you know, folks is human, yeah. But it was one of those times was like you know, it probably won't be replicated in that way ever again because of just how the stars aligned for those moments, but it definitely like you talk about pieces of identity that help shape you, that was one of those times for sure. That's dope. For sure.

SPEAKER_00 20:04

And you wrote your first song in college as well. I did, I did. What was that creative journey like and how did it feel releasing like creating your own song like I ate that thing?

SPEAKER_02 20:16

You know what? Yes, I I think for me it was one of those things where I like I had to trust myself, right? And I think that's the thing with it, right? Like I think that's the thing with a lot of like growing and learning in art is that the first step is to trust that you have the tools already to create, right? Everything else after that is you honing those tools, sharpening those tools. And it's like I knew how to put lyrics together on some level, I knew how to write music and like compose, um, because that's just my like classical background, also like do composition. But like putting those two together was never really my strong suit. So I had people around me that like this is what they did, like they wrote songs and they were great at it. So I'm like, how'd you do that? I started asking questions like, so does the melody go you think you should go up or down? Should we like add a little, you know, a little suspension here? Like, so I started just asking questions and seeing what like what would happen, and you know, and through that I'm like, oh, this makes sense. And I ended up writing some my first music in college with my soul.

SPEAKER_00 21:20

I loved it. So okay, boom, because I like I like moments like this. Like you, because it's like you know, when you watch movies like higher learning or you watch fame, or you it's like you know, you got that one group of people, you just know they gonna be this shit. Like it's like you know they're gonna be everything when they leave this establishment. So, like when you read because you end up graduating from World of Force, okay. So, how so you guys still keep in contact or for the most part.

SPEAKER_02 21:46

I think um we all still like communicate, maybe not all collectively, but like I still keep in contact with all the members. Um they're all doing like extremely well in their like lanes and their pathways. And I think that is the part of it that's like, you know, we were children in. Like we're adults now. Like we're grown girls now. Like some folks is married, got kids, you know, living life, you know what I'm saying? Like some folks are, you know, traveling around the world and like, you know, producing for like artists. And like some folks are like doing amazing things in acting and education. And like, so there's so many like facets like people are touching with from that collective. That's like, yeah, we're doing it.

SPEAKER_01 22:34

I love that.

SPEAKER_02 22:35

I love that. You know what I'm saying? Like, we're really doing it out here. Like, we live in dreams out here. So boom.

SPEAKER_00 22:40

You said you could write a song in an hour. That's that's what the that's what the girls told me. Oh, you could write a song in an hour, okay. I said that. And I said that I'm just guessing. Okay, yeah, possibly, possibly. This is Jay.

SPEAKER_02 22:55

Um, I mean, I'm not saying I can't. Okay, that's that's our dare. That's our dare. I'm not saying I can't. Um, it depends. I think it depends on a lot of factors, right? Not a ton, but a lot. Um, I'm big on whatever feels right in the moment. If I have deeper than just inspiration, right? Because you could be inspired by anything. But I think it comes down to being able to connect to something beyond you, to write something beyond you, right? And whether that's like getting a good feeling or getting inspiration from the music itself or a track or just walking down the street and you have something pop in your head, like, oh, I like that melody, that's cute. I think it depends. Okay, but I'm not saying I can't. You know, you get the job done, my girl. Okay. I'm sure I can, and I have, especially if I'm inspired.

SPEAKER_00 23:50

I was about to say, I feel like you're the type of person, like, once you get inspired, like you gotta go right to the studio. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:55

Period. And that's why I have a studio at my house.

SPEAKER_00 23:57

Yeah, I peep how you say I got to say, come on.

SPEAKER_02 24:00

Got to, because I feel like sometimes inspiration hit. And it's like, I ain't got time to be waiting to get into my we gotta do it right now. Right now. So it's like, yeah, I'm gonna get it done. And you know, even if it's a small reference or something I could give to like an engineer friend of mine or a producer friend of mine, like, whatever I can do, but if I got the means to record it right now, I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna do it right now right now. So, like, that's the benefit of even having a studio or something just record on in your space because it's like you don't have to wait for anybody. You could lay your ideas down, have them, you know, clean it up, do what you need to, and then possibly take it to somebody and they can like add all the finish and touch it and like all keys. Yeah, do all the stuff. Yeah, do all the cute shit. Okay, add a little bass drum, right? A little 808. You know what I'm saying? A little time here and there. But doop doop. You know what I'm saying? Like they can do all the cute shit for you. Like, but sometimes you just gotta get the idea out, and that's it. That's it, and that's how it would be. I I love creating in that way because it's like it gives something deeper, like deeper and more authentic in that way. I like that.

SPEAKER_00 25:04

Yeah. Now, with your two projects, the Jackman show and Orange Moon, it was a gap, right? A large gate. So a large gate. Now tell us about that journey within that large gap and how music possibly changed for you. And when you came back to it, how did that feel in that movie?

SPEAKER_02 25:18

Ooh, that is a that's a great question. So um Jack Bond show came out around 2014. And at that point, I was just super excited about music. Like I was just, but I was also coming off of like a really like at deep at the time, because I was only what in like early mid-20s. Um coming off a breakup, okay, you know, experiencing life. And you know, I was like, oh, I just want to talk about it. Yeah, you know, let's just pop it a little bit. Right, just a little bit. I just want to talk my shit real quick, you know what I'm saying? So, like Jaguar Show came out and like people really loved it and they were receptive to it. I'm like, oh yeah, okay, cool. But life be life in. Yeah. And I was quickly rediscovering the things that mattered to me and like my identity, and also at the same time, between Jack Jacqueline Show and Arch Moon, I came out, right? Came out, I was queer. Come on. So I'm also going through that identity change, right? And like what that means and what that looks like to be a black queer femme in Philly. Like growing as a person. I was growing. Okay, growing pains, okay, still got the stretch. Go from one face to another. Okay, so yeah, yeah. So it was like I that person, and not saying that I'm still I'm not her per se, but like the person that was talking the way that I was on the Jaguar show, yeah, didn't necessarily exist in the ways that she did then, right? Right? So I put out Orange Moon, and like Orange Moon, I feel like was one of those like stepping into like levels of queerness that I'm like, okay, cool, cool, cool. But I was still trying to figure out who I was and how I existed in those realms. And like it was taking me some time, and I don't ever want people to rush like that journey, right? Especially when you're trying to figure out who you are, especially when you're trying to figure out who you are, that goes against what the status quo is, right? Because being black, being queer, being femme, being, you know, like masculine, femme, kind of transitioning between both, like that's that goes extensively beyond what is considered the status quo at the point, right? So it's like I'm trying to figure out who I am, and then also working in realms where people inherently hate me more now. Like you put it that way, inherently hate me more. Inherently hate me more. Like I I was already, we was already two strokes down when I was just like black and a woman, right? That we was already bagged at a hundred.

SPEAKER_00 28:00

But now we had a little queer with a little sprinkles on top. I'm a problem when I wake up. Like I woke up, that's it. I bag I'm a woman and I'm gay. Right.

SPEAKER_02 28:12

I'm a I'm an instant like factor in a lot of people's lives now. Like just because I exist in this way. And it's like, how do you navigate that? Because fuck the art. Y'all say fuck the art. Fuck the art for a second. Because that gets a big thing. For a second. Let's put that bloop, that's put that to the side. Like, you instantly become the thing that challenges like white supremacist structures, right? When you exist in these ways. So now you're in a space of like, okay, not only do I have to figure out my identity and what makes sense for me and how I want to navigate the world. Right. But now I'm in a space where I got a target on my back, I got a target on my front, and maybe on a left side. Just for existence.

SPEAKER_00 28:54

Just for existence. Now, have you ever had people even in the indie creative world treat you different because oh yeah, I'm a woman who's black, who's clear, but I could also sink my ass off. And I have a voice that uh that'll shake the room. So have people even just wanted to work with you just based off that? Yes, and the opposite, right?

SPEAKER_02 29:15

Both ways. Where I've had people like. Yeah, both ways. Like I've had people be like, oh yeah, oh now that you you in this space, cool. And then you get the oh, you now you in this space? Maybe not. Yeah. You know, but that just comes with the territory. Like, I would rather not be a cup of tea for everybody. I would much rather be your glass of wine. Come on. Your, you know, your glass of Hennessy, you know what I'm saying? Like, you know, I ain't trying to be, you know, I ain't trying to be matcha, you know what I'm saying? Come on, that's trying to be like an old-fashioned. Right. It's an acquired taste, it ain't for everybody. None too crazy, just enough. Okay. Lin too crazy, just enough. Just enough. Just enough, period. So it's like you have to be okay with the identity that you observe that is you. Because you're gonna be you whether you like it or not. Whether you like it or not.

SPEAKER_00 30:07

Just stop about that closet. Just come on, come on out.

SPEAKER_02 30:10

Now, if it's safe, only if it's safe. You said only if it's a good idea. Only if it's safe. I like it. Only if it's this my camera, only if it's safe. Okay, don't you bring yourself out that closet if if it's not safe, Bookie. Okay? Don't you you stay right in there. You stay right in there if it's not safe. But if it is, come on out. Come on out, okay? I love that. Big sisters wait for you. Come on out. Come on out. Thank you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 30:35

And stepping, okay. So now we know, you know, she black, queer can sing. Don't forget that. Okay. Boom. Just want to keep reiterating it. Okay, period. So boom, we did classical music, but you stepped your foot in a little whoop-hoop. You know, we learned a lot about discipline through that. Yeah. So what did you what did discipline teach you through vocal blood, using your voice? Ooh.

SPEAKER_02 30:57

It taught me that the voice is not only an instrument instrument, it's a muscle. It is divine connection. It is your ability to connect with source in a deeper way. And my voice has gone through a lot of transitions. Right. Like even last year, um I was diagnosed with like vocal notes. So like kind of been rehabbing my voice since then.

SPEAKER_00 31:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 31:23

Right. And I thought back then that I wasn't going to be able to sing again. Because my I was having the rack of trouble with my voice. Like I didn't have the range. I didn't have the dexterity I used to have. I didn't have any of the vocal clarity. Nothing, like my voice was gone. And I said, and it was gone for like almost like eight months.

SPEAKER_00 31:43

Eight months? How did you like that?

SPEAKER_02 31:47

I still don't know. Um, no, I I do know. I wasn't taking care of myself. I was but before that happened, I was grieving. I was grieving a lot, and I wasn't taking care of myself. So it affected my voice in a way that I wasn't expecting. But I thought I wasn't gonna sing again. So I had to get back into that level of discipline. Like all those like smaller things of like making sure I'm warmed up before I even start speaking in the morning, making sure that I'm going through all of like my vocal training and all the skills that I learned while in college and while at high school, and making sure that I have all those like skills and tools with me. I looked it. So I had to like nature. Yeah, I had to bring those back because I lost those for a second just thinking I was invincible. Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 32:31

You know what I'm saying? Just like working out. Don't we talk about that?

SPEAKER_02 32:33

Okay, you haven't been at gym. Okay, because you will get humbled. And I got humbled a little bit, and I'm like, you know what? Let me go back to my training. And that training saved my voice. It's the reason why I'm still singing now. Because I had to go back to the fundamentals, and it took me a minute, but what you hear? You're good. Here I am. Now I'm still like I said, I'm still rehabbing, I'm still not a hundred percent. But I'm back a little bit, you know what I'm saying? I'm getting there. I'm getting there, you know what I'm saying? Like I'm getting there.

SPEAKER_00 33:09

Now back to your songs. We got Orange Moon, and we got Bitter Girls, and we got Carl Thomas. Now, how do those relate? Because we got one talk about two women finding themselves, and then we got one about heartbreak. Yeah. Carl Thomas, you know, he's emotional. So, period. Okay, so we we talk about our emotions here. Yeah. So now, do they all coincide with one another, or or or are those three different phases that you went through?

SPEAKER_02 33:34

Definitely three different phases. Um, I think you know, bitter girls being part of the Jacqueline show, that was a phase I was going through coming off a breakup um when I was younger. And then Orange Moon was more like nothing I actually did in real life. I get that question a lot because the the song is about me like, you know, cheating on the cheater with the cheated, you know what I'm saying? Like it's one of those type times, right? Um, no, that did not happen in real life. I was just being dramatic, okay, for the sake of the plot. Um, but that was also like, you know, exercise in the writing bag and storytelling, right? And then Carl Thomas was a space where I was coming off of a breakup, but later on in life, more mature, more like realizing like, you know, this wasn't ever meant to work, right? So definitely like totally different phases of like heartbreak, because I was in different phases of life and maturity in each one. Um, but I think Carl Thomas for me is probably the one that is still more reminiscent of who I am today, still. Um, because it it's like the acknowledgement of like, yeah, I'm a little hurt. But then it's like, you you must you lost out a little bit, and that's okay.

SPEAKER_00 34:53

At least you can admit it. We love a Leo. Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_02 34:57

Now we can honestly ability. Here's the thing. We are honest, okay?

SPEAKER_00 35:02

I love y'all.

SPEAKER_02 35:03

We we on the sun. Like when the sun is out and shining, we gonna shine down. Okay? But when that you'll but you know, because when that motherfucker set, yeah. Oh, I know. Okay, it's like, oh no, we're gonna be honest. We're gonna, because what do we have to lose?

SPEAKER_00 35:26

She said a lot to me. What do we have to lose? What do we have to lose? That's so whimsical. You're fun.

SPEAKER_02 35:32

You're fun. You're a Leo's always gonna give you the best time of your life. I do hit a time. Okay. Okay, okay, speak it. Speak it. Okay, put it out there, put it out there, let them know. Let them know.

SPEAKER_00 35:44

I love my I love my little lion. You mean okay, period. Let him know. My little lion, she a drone. Uh-huh. She a drone. She do what she she does. Okay. You see the mean. Okay. Okay, period. You see how it goes how it does. Period. I'm not gonna get too much into Zodiac because if I talk about Virgos, how much additional? No.

SPEAKER_02 36:03

No, no, because my best friend is a Virgo. One of my best friends is a Virgo. Okay, so boom. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 36:08

So I'm about to answer what so how do you deal with your with a with a Virgo best friend?

SPEAKER_02 36:16

Patience. Patience is the big one. Okay? Because a Virgo is gonna speak that mind. Gonna speak that mind every time. Because I'm Rulder Mercury, thank you. Okay, okay. It's gonna be and it's gonna be clear. It's gonna be concise. It's not gonna be misconstruable in any way, shape, or form. It's gonna be very clear. Okay? Very clear. Capital C. A few times my my best friend has been like, hey, hey, hey, come here, come here. Um, so that right there, that's not gonna work. That's not gonna work. That's not gonna work for me. Um, fix that. Fix that right now. Fix like you like right now. Like, right now. I'm I'm not even gonna give you time to even like think about it. I need you to fix it right now. Oh my god. Yes, ma'am. I sure will. I sure will. You love the deal. You won't fix it. Because I'm gonna fix it. I'm gonna fix it. I fix it. Here's the thing about a Virgo Virgo's not gonna tell you anything that doesn't that doesn't apply. This is not an ego-driven thing. This is like a our people's going on. I don't like it. And I love you. So not the finger, so I love you.

SPEAKER_00 37:18

I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you. I love you. So then how is a Leo? How do you respond? Do you gotta growl first? You might you might do the look.

SPEAKER_02 37:31

All right, I guess you might get hit with a, I guess, or it depending on the severity of it, like, okay, all right, I got you. Solid. Because the thing about a Leo, a Leo, Leos appreciate honesty. Folks think that Leos can't take honesty.

SPEAKER_00 37:51

I was about to say, but help me out with that.

SPEAKER_02 37:54

Hear me out, hear me out. And people are about to be in the comments, no, it's Leo's hear me out. Leos love honesty, but you gotta deliver that honesty with care. It gotta be in care. It gotta care, compassion, empathy. It gotta be packaged like that. All right. If it ain't packaged like that, you can leave it at the door. Leave it at send it in the send it in the email.

SPEAKER_00 38:17

Damn, I just feel like y'all both told me about myself.

SPEAKER_02 38:19

Yeah, keep it in the two different ways. Keep it in the drafts. Keep it in the drafts for sure. Keep it in the drafts, keep it in the drafts. So yeah, rewrite it. Because I'm a little aggressive. Yep. Now maybe, maybe possibly. Care. Care. But a little softer, right? A little, not even softer. When I say care, I don't necessarily mean it has to be like gentle. Okay. We can take it. It gotta be care, it has to have care in it. Concern. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 38:47

So like add a little concern in your tone.

SPEAKER_02 38:49

Not even in the tone. It's not just the tone. So I I think it's a combination of all of it, right? When I say care, it means that you're coming to me, not necessarily because it's just like maybe I did something that was fucked up. Niggas is human. I hear you. Let me know how I hurt you. Let me know. Like you don't even have to, you like, sure, like be like, damn, that hurt my feelings. What about I hear you? I'm sorry that hurt your feelings. What about that hurt your feelings? So I don't ever do that shit ever again. Right. I'm just saying. Okay. I'm when I say care and empathy, and that's just that's more directed at me. Now, if you do something fucked up, right? And I'm, you know what I'm saying? Turn the tables, and I'm like, yo, yo, baby, you did something crazy. And y'all sweet with it though. Y'all, y'all are tender. Y'all are very tender. Very, very. But if you see the tenderness, that means we trust you. That means you trust you. No one gets the tender. Everyone gets the growl.

SPEAKER_00 40:12

Oh my gosh, that's so true.

SPEAKER_02 40:14

Niggas get the mane. Like niggas get the growl. They get they get the burn from the sun. They don't get the warmth.

SPEAKER_00 40:22

Yeah. She's tender.

SPEAKER_02 40:24

Yeah, so if you get a little, you get a little tenderone, that means she's comfortable.

SPEAKER_00 40:29

That's my I ain't gonna lie, that's my tenderoni. No shade.

SPEAKER_02 40:32

You know what I'm saying? We let it. We let it. Okay, period. We love a little tenderoni. But she's tender because she trusts your ass.

SPEAKER_00 40:40

Don't take it for granted. Well, I've learned a lot about not only a Leo but myself. Okay, okay. In this moment, thank you. No problem. Can't wait to have another Leo in the chat.

SPEAKER_02 40:50

Okay. Period. Okay. I don't know that Leo's in the comments gonna be like, that's right. Wow. Uh huh. We mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 40:56

This is the first time I agree. Wow. Sorry to my Virgos, like I let y'all dance, tell me evolved.

SPEAKER_02 41:03

No, we love we love the Virgos too. Okay, because it always comes from a place of love. Y'all ruled by Mercury.

SPEAKER_00 41:08

No, you're right. You're right.

SPEAKER_02 41:09

So it's like it comes from a place of like very much so concerned very much so like you're gonna speak your truth. Mercury's by communication. Yes, like that's the root. So it's like, oh yeah, like you're gonna speak your mind. And speaking of truth, in their mind, yes, boom.

SPEAKER_00 41:25

So you came out. I did to your parents or to your mom, because you know you gotta serve my mom first, right? Yeah, yeah. Okay, so in that moment, you already knew who you were. Boom. You said you know, I like the girls, you know. Okay, I like the girls.

SPEAKER_02 41:40

The girls, the girls, love a woman down.

SPEAKER_00 41:43

I love your woman down, damn, okay. Oh, just uh I let them boys too, but don't be in my comments though, because I let them girls say I got girlfriends, too. So they are they they are, yeah. Like they're cool, whatever. They're cool, they they cool to look at. But that girl, that them girl, Yoshi, yeah. I'm gonna say her name one clip. That's mine. Okay, that's that's me. That's me. I love that. I love it. Damn it, yes. So when you went to your mom, you was like, you know what? I'm gonna sit you down, I gotta tell you something.

unknown 42:15

Set the scene, bow.

SPEAKER_02 42:17

You know what's funny? Um, sorry, sorry, family. Um, I did not tell my mom. Oh, my sister said. So I have three sisters. Um I do. I'm the middle child of four.

SPEAKER_00 42:29

And we're gonna talk more about that. Bye.

SPEAKER_02 42:31

Yes, we're gonna come, yes, we're gonna come back to that for sure. But I ended up um telling my sisters first. Um, and this was right after, I believe, the pulse shooting that happened in Florida. And I'm like, you know what, it's about time. And I told my sisters and and eventually made it back to my mother. So me and my mom never had that chat. But we did have a chat in our own special way that only my mother could really give me. So um maybe a year or so later later, maybe I think um poise, post, post, post, post, that's the show. Poise. Um, post came out. And I don't watch TV that often, but my mom does. And she invited me over, and we was like cooking, chilling, you know, drinking a little wine, you know, very mother and daughter things. And she ended up turning on the TV show. And she was like, Have you watched this show yet? I'm like, No, I haven't watched it, you know. I'm busy, I don't really watch TV like that. She was like, You should watch it. I think it would be a really cool thing to watch. And I'm like, okay, solid. But in the midst of the show, we're watching it, and we started talking about marriage. I don't even know how we got there, but she was like, you know, marriage is important, and it should happen between people that love each other. No matter who that is, whether that's man or woman, woman or woman, man or man, it doesn't matter. Whoever is She directed it to me. She said, Whoever you need to be with, the top line should be that you love them. And I said, Heard. Heard mom. And that was like, that was her giving me the signal of like, I love you. I see you. And like, as long as they treat you right, I'm Gucci. So that's my boots. That's that's when my roots are coming out story. Shout out to Rita. Shout out to Rita. You know what I'm saying? That's that's my rock.

SPEAKER_00 44:27

Yeah, that's my rock. Now, is this the moment where you started changing the pros pronouns in your songs? Because I know you would talk about him, and then the more you got comfortable and it was freeing talking to your mother. That's how everything changed.

SPEAKER_02 44:40

That's when everything changed. And now don't get me wrong, like I feel like there was it's always, especially in around that time frame, even though like being gay, being queer was like more socially acceptable, like there was still like a little bit of like discourse around, especially being from Philly, yeah, aggressive. Right, right. You know what I'm saying? So like you hide in plain sight, you might change the pronouns of a song here and there. But when my mama said I was good with this gay shit, all bets are off. I'm talking about all the bitches. What do we do? I'm talking about all the bitties. As soon as she said, Oh yeah, you good in my book, oh yeah, we talked about all the women.

SPEAKER_00 45:17

By the time I get home, I'll be in the studio.

SPEAKER_02 45:19

I'm in the studio talking about the girls. What are they? You know what I'm saying? So it was like she solidifies a lot of my identity. She she didn't create it, she didn't build it. Yeah, but those parts of it, if my mom sees me, so we felt safe, like this safe, free moment.

SPEAKER_00 45:36

I look at you. Absolutely, absolutely. And I say free because I remember when me and my mom had the conversation. I just was talking to somebody about that, and we was just talking. I was like, you know, having a normal conversation with her. She was like, it don't matter. Like, she was like, You want to have a kid with a woman, like, go here. I was like, oh, say that. We can't make mama love.

SPEAKER_02 45:56

Say less. I'm and I'm dropping them off to you, mom. Yeah, like say it. Come on, grandma, let's get it. That's right.

SPEAKER_00 46:03

Yeah, I'm gonna like, yo, yo, stuff.

SPEAKER_02 46:05

You think you can you babysit tonight or no?

SPEAKER_00 46:08

Like, you you if it ain't on you, just let me know.

SPEAKER_02 46:10

Yeah, just let me know if you ain't free. You know, just not available, you know.

SPEAKER_00 46:16

So then with the music you write now, yeah, how is it shaping who you are today? Like the jangle we know, the one that's doing the shows, you know, changing the image, the sound. Yeah. Get into all of we love to see you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 46:32

I think the Jacqueline now has gone through a lot, right? I mean, as one does, maturing, growing, becoming a better person, moving through, you know, the ages. And but who I am now is a direct reflection of the hell I've gone through and and survived, right? And I'm no, it's no secret that I've had some really not just challenging, but like really dark experiences um recently. And it's shaped me. It's molded me into someone who's unfuckwittable, and I ain't really got time to be dilly-dallying with the possibility of who I could be. I'm talking about right now. I'm talking about right now and who I am and who like this this form, this shape, this soul, this spirit was tried by fucking fire, and I'd be damned if I let anything or anyone deter me from that path. Come on. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'm here for a very, and I feel this in like in my spirit, like I'm here for a very specific reason. Good. You know what I'm saying? So I'm pushing on this path because I feel like I have no other choice.

SPEAKER_00 47:53

You ain't got no other choice, because you and I'm gonna tell you why. Boom. Here's the PowerPoint, right? So let me know. Okay, so boom, right? Watching you grow as a creator, okay? We see you on stage, we know that you can sing, you got your loot machine, we know that you can put the whole production by yourself. Yeah, but what we didn't know is that you really have the right to actually talk about music because you lived, you lived it. Yeah, you lived, you know, through the instruments, you lived through the phases where you were passionate, you studied, you know, the greats, you did that. Yeah, and you can speak on certain topics because we have that experience. Yeah. Yeah. And because of your experience, people are now seeing, okay, she's more than her music. She has a voice and she she knows who she's talking about, she knows the understanding of hip hop, she knows the understanding of RB. She knows where it originates from, she knows how it shapes black people as a culture, yeah, and not just you know, for herself. Like you got these different celebrities, and not just anybody. It ain't like like you got these, you know, teddy, I see that. I all I want to do is um zoom, you know commenting, you know. Like you got these top people really understanding where you're coming from because they live those experiences, yeah. So with that being said, yeah, you ain't got no choice, mama. Just wanted to put that out there. I appreciate the Virgo. Yeah, like you had a choice.

SPEAKER_01 49:22

Lead it to me, like pull me up, like yes, thank you. Thank you for that.

SPEAKER_00 49:26

Like, yeah, like you, you, you, you deserve your followers.

SPEAKER_02 49:30

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 49:30

You do. We talking about we we saw we we saw the followers going up each day. We saw it, we saw it. Like, yeah, I remember seeing I said, damn. Wait a minute. That was a week, but that was like 10 days. It's crazy. But now that you got there, and we see the hard work that you yeah did and still doing, yeah, what's what's that like? Like knowing these people know you. Teddy, teddy and them know her, y'all. I know her, y'all.

SPEAKER_02 50:01

Um, to be completely honest, it is it's different. And I I say that as someone who's still like building a career, building a fan base, building a supporter base, and all those things. Um, heightened visibility in itself is different. Heightened visibility um on social media is different. Height visibility when people know you is a totally different ball game. And I'm I'm adjusting in ways that like it comes with the territory, but also it's like this is different. Like I don't, I think the not the weirdest instance, because I don't want to call it weird, but like the most interesting instance I've ever had was that um I was I was at the gym. And I'm a I'm a gym rat down. I'm always in the gym. Like, if I can't hit a two a day, like I I'm always in the gym. So I'm I'm in the gym, I'm stretching, like you know, finishing my workout, boy, we did a two-hour set, like strength training, heavy weights. I'm in there stretching. Ah someone is staring at me, and I'm like, it's Philly, this is Philly. Okay, so like you stared at me, I'm like, I was looking at it like hello, but they end up coming to me. And it was like, are you like like a content creator? Like, have you gone viral lately? I'm like, maybe.

SPEAKER_01 51:28

Right.

SPEAKER_02 51:28

Ah, I don't know. I don't, I don't know, you're like what you're like, oh no, your name, you're Jacqueline Cousins. Mind you, I'm I know, I know. I'm like, because you know, you somebody me mugging you, you think is it's like you just wanna fight. And we can all we gonna always do that. Okay, we gonna always fight. Um, I'm I'm that type of bull. Like we we can always fight. That's the default. Um, but when they like said Jacqueline Constance, I'm like, I had to disarm myself for a second. I'm like, oh, okay, you've seen a video. Let me wanna fuck you up a little bit. Right, let me let me bring it down. I'm like, yeah, that was me. She was like, oh my god, like that was so amazing. Like, can I get a picture? Now I'm also in a place that I'm not supposed to be, like, I'm still on like work hours. So like I'm not supposed to be here. Like I slid out of work early, like wasn't supposed to do that. So I'm like, not really, because you can't post it now. And I don't want to give you, like, right, I don't want to be weird about it, but I'm like, I'm not supposed to be here, supposed to be at work. Um, but they were really cool about it, she was really cool about it. She was like, no worries, like, you know, I just want to let you know. So it's like stuff like that. That's like, oh, this is different. Yeah, this is different. It's a thing, it's it's a thing, and I I appreciate it. Don't get me wrong, like I appreciate it down, but it's different, it's very different, and I'm I'm still adjusting, and and it's still in the scheme of like where I want to continue to go. This is like first steps, right? Like these are baby steps, but it's different.

SPEAKER_00 53:03

I just know what it is because how did you find that was it? Like you you set everything up and you did this song, and you was like, okay. Can I be real with you?

SPEAKER_02 53:13

Um, I posted a video. Like, I've now don't get wrong. We I've been doing content for years. Years. I had little splashes in the bucket here or there. Right? Cool. I posted a random video of me singing a song on a random Saturday. I usually don't get any hits on a Saturday, like Saturday, midday too, like three o'clock. It started to do numbers. By the time like Sunday hit, had like 500 new followers. I said, Oh, I ain't never seen that mild movement. That's crazy. Welcome, y'all. Hey. By that Tuesday, I went from like 5,000 followers to 11,000. And I said, Oh, okay. Okay, this is so I'm like, let's keep it going. And that's how the series started. It was like, it took one video doing something. I'm like, okay, people like this. Let's keep going with it. And honestly, that was it'll be two years in August. And then we're coming up on the 200th uh series video. Yeah, I think because you posted 1990 recently, yeah. So I think by the by the time folks see this, we'll be in like the 200 territory. So it's like it worked, and it's gotten me a lot of visibility really quickly, and I'm thankful for that. But now it's time for the music, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 54:43

You gotta music. So you said Jill Scott's first album showed you the music you wanted to make was possible, and the Philly in her made it hit different. What does Philly actually put in the music for you?

SPEAKER_02 54:55

Ooh, that that is oh, that's such a good question. Philly has just a natural level of like grit, right?

SPEAKER_03 55:04

And they were grit.

SPEAKER_02 55:06

You can you can hear the difference in a Philly artist than you would like a New York artist, a Detroit artist. Not saying anyone's better than the other, but there's a very particular lived experience that like a Philly bowl, a Philly John has that shapes how they do music. It shapes how they structure lyrics, it shapes how they say the words, it's like you can hear it. And like our experiences in Philly are really bar none because like there's don't get me wrong, like there are other cities that are doing hip hop and doing RB and doing music in these ways, but that particular album came out of like Neo Soul, right? And Neo Soul was birthed here, yes, you know what I'm saying? Like a lot of other cities can claim different genres and things like that. Neo soul is inherently Philly. Listen, that's us all the way, all the way down starting point, like the hardest nigga is listening to Neo Soul. Okay, that's us. It's because it was it was like such a groundbreaking space because it took some of like these natural rhythms and patterns that we already knew and like expanded on them in like these different ways. And it's like, oh, this is nice. I like this. So that her first album was one of those albums where I'm like, you know, like I talked about Elephant Gerald. It's like anything that makes the light bulb go off.

SPEAKER_01 56:32

It's like, oh, okay, okay.

SPEAKER_02 56:36

We can we can add like you know, some classical melodies in here, like we could add like an ostinado bass, like to like we could, we could do that. Oh, okay, okay, no. So it's like one of those things where I'm like, oh, I could actually use like this classical training. I don't have to drop it off, I could use it to start creating this music. So it was like, okay, I I see myself in this album. I love that. So it felt like home. It felt like home. Yes. Feel safe. Feel safe. And it's Philly down. Like Jill Scott is is undeniably, no matter where she moves, where she lives at, right? She is undeniably Philly. She's Philly. But that that's what us Philly folks do, no matter where we go. We're gonna be Philly. Always. It's always, always. So it's like that album is it's one of my favorites. I love that.

SPEAKER_00 57:31

Well, I love Joe Scott, period. Okay. So, because y'all know how I feel about my girl, Joe. Okay. I'm gonna call you.

SPEAKER_02 57:37

Okay, okay. Okay, come on out. Okay, it's nice here. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 57:42

You got Ella, we got Jill, and we got Kendrick. Yes, yeah. I knew you were gonna love that one. Then how would you say that he's changed the way you actually like construct the song? Ooh, Kendrick, Kendrick Lamar.

SPEAKER_02 58:01

First of all. Now, we can play sides and favorites. I know what folks are gonna say. Like, oh, you just a sure. Say what you want.

SPEAKER_00 58:09

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 58:10

Say what you want. But I think there's fundamentally something deeply musical about what Kendrick Lamar does. You don't always get that from a rapper, right? Like, I think that's where people like lose like some of their integrity of the argument when they talk about who's better. Like, Kendrick is inherently musical. Like, he puts songs together, like, but songs in ways that like even his backgrounds we have in melodies.

SPEAKER_00 58:41

And I'm like, I'm about to say, like, he switches his tone up, like he gets into a character, gets out of characters.

SPEAKER_02 58:48

Yes, but it's literally like it's theater, it's drama. Yes, like every time, every album, like from you know, from section 80 to overly dedicated before that, the mixtape to up until damn to you know, the big steppers, like Damn, I really feel like that was a stepper step forward. That's that's the one that was the one for over. That was the winner, that was the surprise one, you know what I'm saying? So it's like when you listen to a Kendrick, you also listen to his phases, right? You listen to how he's matured, but you also hear how he has reimagined or how he's relearning like that's the music. Right, and that's the part that gets me. Like, you can tell he's a constant student, he's constantly learning, and you hear it every project, and that's that's the shit I fuck with. I love it. Like, you can hear that he studies the shit, like, even down to like GNX. Like, GNX is a is a West Coast album down, but it's because you study the West Coast legends to get there, and not just a Pac either. Like, you can tell, like he puts some intention into his work. I'm not saying that, you know, no one else does, but I'm saying he doesn't on a level, he does it on a higher level than I feel like a lot of people do. So, like, the way he moves through music influences me. Because he moves through music like like a screenwriter works through a play or a movie. Like it's a concept.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:19

I love the yeah, like I man, let me tell you something. So how you explain that was so beautiful? Well, this is poetic in itself. For sure. What does that look like? How does the studio session look like with you and Kendrick Lamar?

SPEAKER_01 1:00:37

First of all, first of all, wait a minute, hold on. Come on, talk about it.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:41

This was my dreams are made of. Okay, um I think the first couple hours of the session is just us talking. I can see that. Yes. It's just us like he's a deep thinker. Yeah, like I want to know how you think. I want to, I'm so curious on how you see the world. Because of how you shape the music. Your viewpoints, your worldview is different. And it's because of your experiences. And it's also because of like your learning every day. Like your ability to learn is doubled upon every day. I'm curious on how you see the world. Let's just talk first.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:22

I like that. Hmm. That brings me back into what you was talking about, how you go through your you know, different phases of music. So I like how you always talk about experiences because some people go in the studio, they like, all right, I'm a musician, I'm gonna go in here because I feel like it's gonna make me some money. Yeah. Like so, how do you navigate that part about you? Your experiences, and then bring it into the studio. Because sometimes it could be hard, you know, creating after, you know, any tumultuous point in your life. Yeah. So how do you navigate that part of your life?

SPEAKER_02 1:01:54

I'm honest. There are things that period. Real shit. There are things that I'm never gonna talk about. At least not out loud. Because those are mine.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:07

Okay. You know what I'm saying? So the boundaries come into flow.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:10

Yeah, like those are mine. Those are like my own internal things. But there are a ton of other things that you I'm an open book.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:18

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:18

Talk to me, talk to me. And I think that's like the part of this that like allows me to even still be able to create is that like I know myself in those ways where it's like you give me, you give me a particular subject, and I'm like, huh, you might have to. You might have to, you know. Or I'm not above like reaching out to another writer.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:44

Yeah, you know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_02 1:02:45

A collaborating with another writer. I'm not above that. I'm not one of them ones that I wrote everything, I produced everything. Um and I'll be like, yeah, I can tell. You know what I'm saying? Like, like, I can tell. Like, but that was shade. Um not to nobody. Don't don't don't be in the comments. Like, I know who you talk about. No, you don't. No, no, no, no, no, no. Um, but no, it's I understand my strengths and weaknesses. And that comes from the experience, right? Like, I understand what I'm good at. I know what I'm fabulous at. And I know what I'm like, not so much. You know what I'm saying? And I feel like that goes into the creative process as well. It's like there are things that I'm gonna be able to knock out 30 minutes, boom, done, bam. Then there's gonna be some things where it's like, uh, this might take a day, or something. Or three. You know what I'm saying? So like I'm I'm honest about myself in those ways. And I think that's what makes like the creative process easier because I am honest, even to a fault.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:46

Come on, come on.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:47

I love that.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:48

The girls is in their era, okay, okay. The girls is in their era, y'all. And I and I like how you said you're not going back to that to that shit no more. Like you're not going, you now that you hear that's it. That's it. That's it. So what changed about, like, what changed, and that was it. Like when you stepped into the room, you wrote, don't fuck with me. Yeah, and you said, Okay, this is my time, this is my moment, the studio session is over, we'll be back soon.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:19

Right. But was that? Like, it was my general frustration with the world that I didn't want to now this is because that's rude. This is the sag mood of me. Um, that I didn't want to filter out into any other space of my life. I would much rather put it on wax than to put it on these fists. You know what I'm saying? Like, so when I'm going on a record and I started with like, you got a bitch fucked up, I mean it, and I'm gonna leave it there. Like, music in some ways is my therapy. Now, I do have a therapist, don't get me wrong. Okay, okay, pay her every two weeks. Thank you so much. Um, but it's like my safe space. So, like, I talk about things and I I'm angry on the records, and I do the things that I need to, and it's cathartic, it's therapy, it's it's movement of energy without movement of these hands, and folks need to be happy about that. Repeat that. It's movement of this energy without movement of these hands. Okay, you know, hmm, I gotta start writing these things down. Okay. Folks, I'd be happy that I just hit play and play that's it. And I didn't hit your hit you in the top of your fucking head.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:35

You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_02 1:05:37

You're right.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:37

Because I could have just smacked the shit out.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:39

I could have just smacked the shit out you, and we could have kept it moving. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 1:05:43

But um a little harder. Right. I'm gonna hit you in these records. That's one thing about Leo. Y'all got that thing about y'all. You know what I'm saying? I got that thing. It's like, damn, I sound.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:53

I hope so.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:54

My soul.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:54

I hope so. Cause that's much better than alternative.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:58

Come on.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:01

For sure.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:02

And you worked with somebody named King Brit?

SPEAKER_02 1:06:05

I did. Come on, couple, couple. I was. I first of all, big homie, OG in the game. Um, when we talk about legends, living legends, King Britt is one of them.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:19

Um, just that experience, like working toward, well, I said towards y'all, working beside.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:25

You know what? It was one of those things where like I was, you know, moving and grooving through the music and through Philly, and he contacted me, he was like, I love what you're doing. Come to the studio, let's create. I said, What? Me? Excuse me? Like, we're talking about one of the purveyors, like, we talk about Neil Sol and that movement. He was there. He was one of like the front runners of these movements. You know what I'm saying? So we're like, we talk about this is an OG OG. Right. So for him to be like to see me in that way, it's like, oh. People watching. Yeah. Which is crazy, like the visibility of it. It's like, oh no, people are paying attention.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:11

Wild. Because sometimes you work, you know, you are creative. Sometimes you feel like you're in a silo, right? And you're like working and like you love what you're doing, but you don't know exactly who's watching, who's engaging. Right. But then someone confirms it for you. It's like, oh, we're actually. Yeah. And we're actually doing something. Okay. Let's do it. So I got invited to the studio. We worked on music on his last Lost in Paradigm album, which was an amazing experience. We actually took it on like a mini tour, um, like 2016, 2017. That was the time that was so good. And I I owe him a lot because he taught me a lot around like being able to be creative on your own terms.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:54

So what about working with more mother and Nassaj? I think this is how you say it. N-O-S-A-J. No. We just won't worry about that.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:14

I've never worked with more mother either. I've done a show with her, but I've never worked for her. Oh, well, tell us about the show. How was the show? That was a time ago. That was some years ago. That was uh that same, that same era uh with King Britt. And like we shared a build. I actually met her a few times. She's amazing.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:31

That's dope.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:32

She's dope. She's dope.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:38

That's what you do. So like, yeah, what would younger Jacqueline say about older Jacob?

SPEAKER_02 1:08:43

Ooh, ooh. Um, she would be proud. Um, she would be like, what the hell is this? Oh, this is girl. This is this is nice. You ain't got no roaches or nothing. Um, but no, she would be, she would be impressed. Yeah, but this is very impressive. Yeah, and young Jack was not easily impressed at all. Yeah. Let me tell you something. I was uh really, I was a pretentious, but like I was you not much impressed me as a child. Not much. Yeah, I think she would be impressed. She'll be like, I don't know, look at you. Hello. And I thank you.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:20

Thank you, girl.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:21

You know what I'm saying? I love me. Yes. And we what? We in May about to be in June? What can we expect from Jaguar for the rest of 2026 going on this 2027?

SPEAKER_02 1:09:32

So we're definitely getting new music. Yes, we're getting a ton of new music, and I'm so excited. Yeah, I'm I'm so excited to drop a lot of this music. I've been working with a ton of new producers and collaborators. My main collaborator right now is my homie Chris Cargo, and he's amazing. Just a dope producer, musician all around, and like we've been grinding out. We've been working. It's a blessing. So I'm I'm blessed, and I'm so excited for you all to like to hear this music. Like, it's so good. So it's gonna be a cool run of like really dope music and really dope songs and songs that speak to like we talked about, like who I am and like the journey of how I got here. So by the time this airs, uh, we'll have a date. We'll have some dates aligned and ready to ship out to the world. But I'm excited.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:32

You should be. Yeah, I am. What is your greatest advice that you would give anybody? Like, you know, growing a fan base or just growing in the creative space. Ready? We always ready for some good, give it to us.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:49

Find a thing that you do naturally, and just do that. Whatever you do naturally, it's simple, simple, right? Because I naturally I can sing, right? Cool, I can write songs, I can loop. What else I do naturally, I could talk. I have opinions, and those things are also putting me in different spaces and different lanes and different things. So what I would tell anyone, especially if folks trying to get in like the social media game, and whatever you do naturally, whatever you do when you're kicking it with your homies, 3 a.m. on a Friday, and y'all on the way from like Wawa, like, and y'all about to get out the car and to put in your Wawa order. Whatever you're doing right then, do that. Do that, do that, do that. I promise you, that is gonna fend well for you because that's what you do naturally. If I get to a cipher, you might as well just start recording me, bro. Right, you might as well just put me in this right. Just press play. Press play. Because no one on this world on on this planet can be you. Come on, no one, and you're denying the world who you are if you try to fit into anything else that doesn't fit into who you are, that's right.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:06

Be you, like we don't want nobody else, we want you. That's so true, yes, and stop letting social media dictate who you are. My god, my god, it's okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:15

Uh, but I get it. The algorithm rewards rewards, you know, the same type of things. But every now and again, you break through because you are doing something that's authentically you. That's it. Like, I literally watched someone create cakes based off the concept of RB songs. Like they're a baker and they make cakes, but right, and they I'll send it to you, and they make cakes based off of like what they feel conceptually from the song. Makes cakes off of that, yes, and I'm all that's a concept, that's a concept, and like, yeah, it may not be getting traction now. Cool, but it will, but it will because that's creative, and that's something that that's different, and it took someone being like, I'm gonna do this. So just do you. That's that's all I got. Like, I ain't no fluff to it, ain't no special shit, ain't no special sauce, just do you.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:15

And speaking of press and play, we're gonna play a game.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:18

Oh, yeah, it's a game, it's a game. I love a game. I love a little game show.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:25

You know, boom. I'm ready. Okay, so for this game is called Speed Ram. Maybe a question? Okay, you're gonna give me a fancy answer. Pow! Okay, I can do it. I can do it. So, first album you memorized front to bed. Uh Boys and Men 2. Come on. A song you wish you had written. Uh oh, uh Love is Stronger than Pride. Shout out. The Philly artist right now who deserves way more flowers. TRWAC. Come on. What are you listening to when you have nothing to prove to anybody? Oh, rock mine off.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:58

A song that broke your heart. Oh, um, um, mmm, mmm, mmm, mmm.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:06

Um, anything Donnie Hathaway. Okay. Okay. A song, a song that put it back together. Oh, um, Yellow by uh Indi Ayrie. Philly in one word. Dickhead. What are you talking about? Yeah. A lyric of yours that still surprises you when you hear it back.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:23

Ooh, um, ooh, ooh, ooh. In in this one of the new songs gonna release called Slip Away. Um, I say a line that says, Um, this love was cheap, but at the seams like a bad size. I said, ooh, I did that.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:43

Went right down, went down. Okay. Mm-hmm. I ate that. Ate that. The looper dies on your on you midset.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:52

What do you do? Ooh, ooh, ooh. We pull out the iPad, we pull out the tracks. Come on. Don't monkey mess up the circus, baby. Okay. We're gonna keep it moving. Okay, we got things to do. We got things to play. Okay. I always gotta play in B and C. Hello. One song you could perform for the rest of your life. You got me by the roots.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:14

She moved faster than a lot of you niggas.

unknown 1:15:16

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:20

Copy that. Copy that. I'll be doing what I can. So boom, then we're gonna go to the next game. Oh, the good joint. Okay. So keep it, cut it, or lose it forever. Keep it cut it for losing. With this one, it's three artists, three fates, and no way out.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:38

Ooh, okay. Keep it, cut it, lose it forever. Wow, you're gonna get me in trouble. Okay, I already feel it in my spirit. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:44

So the three artists. No? Okay. Option one. So just read the options.

unknown 1:15:50

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:51

Keep the whole thing. Option one, keep the whole thing. One artist, full disography, stays completely intact. Every album, every era, every b side. You keep all of it forever, and you can listen whenever you want.

unknown 1:16:05

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:06

Okay. Option two, keep the first two or three years only. One artist, you only get the early work. The first two or three years of their career, and that's it. Everything they made after that, gone. You never hear it again. Okay. And then option three, lose the whole discography forever. One artist, entire catalog disappears. Every album, every feature, every live recording, wiped. Gone forever. You never hear a single song from them again. You have to assign every slot and tell me exactly why. No ties. No, I can't do this. You're doing this. You're doing it. You're gonna get me in trouble. And the artist. Alright, I love it. Oh, Jesus. Okay, go ahead. Go ahead. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:51

Oh, Jesus. Okay, um.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:56

Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:58

I know. I'm so sorry.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:00

Wow. Um would you do this to me? My God, on today. My god, we were friends. I thought we were friends. Um okay, so Kendrick, we're keeping this whole discography. I can't throw it. We're keeping it. We're keeping every album, every perfection. We're keeping all of it. Um Jilly, we're gonna we're gonna keep them first two years. Them first couple projects.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:34

Ooh, okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:35

Now, this the thing, this the thing. I'm only saying we can get rid of Ella because yes, because look here. But she did mostly like covers, okay? Most of the music back then, but the jazz music was mostly covers. They were covers of so they weren't necessarily most, they weren't always original music.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:57

But that's the only reason why she stayed in y'all. She loves Ella.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:01

Oh my god. I'm so flourished then.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:05

God, but you was honest.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:06

I gotta add some libations to the altar. God damn it.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:09

That was later. I know.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:12

Wow. Wow. That hurt that hurt me a little bit. Wow, wow. I gotta thank you.

unknown 1:18:19

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:21

All right. It's okay. It's okay. Damn, that's that's crazy. That's that's a crazy game. Shit, but we're gonna follow up. We got more. We got more. You're gonna keep breaking my heart, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:18:34

Now, what about this though? Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:37

Jesus Christ.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:37

If you only kept Ella's first two years, what specific recorders would you hold on to and why? See?

SPEAKER_02 1:18:45

Ooh, we can breathe a bit. Okay, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Um, I think most of her the core of her catalogs in the first couple years anyway. So, like, um, but I would lose that live in Paris album. That was later in her life.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:01

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:02

That's fine. It's fine. It's fine. Okay. It's fine. Well, I would, yeah, I would. She doesn't necessarily have any like specific recordings that like fall in that category. Like, she has like some bigger bodies of work, but like her more famous songs, like Atiscit, Atasket, and um, like she did a cover of um Strange Fruit. Like, those are kind of like earlier um sort of time frames, at least I think. Um, so yes, that's kind of where I would lean. But that's hard though, because I feel like she the her best recordings are when she was older, and like that that voice was becoming a little bit more seasoned, you know what I'm saying? Had a little bit more old bay on it, you know what I'm saying? Had a little mmm, had a little spice on it. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_01 1:19:49

Like, mmm, that that's hard, that's such a hard question. I know this was tough. This was tough. This it's okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:58

I forgive you. But what you lost forever, mmm, is there one song from that catalog that genuinely hurts to let go?

SPEAKER_02 1:20:07

That that whole live in Paris album. That was like later, yeah, that was later in her life. We're gonna get through this together. I will cry. I will cry real thug tears losing that album. My god. Okay, I'll you wanna see a thug cry?

SPEAKER_00 1:20:25

That's a hurt, that's a hurt piece. I'm sorry, that's okay. The one you kept, oh, the one you kept the whole disography, what era of their catalog shaped you the most as an artist?

SPEAKER_02 1:20:36

Oh, oh, um, section 80. That right after the mixtape, right before the full album, section 80, baby. That up that's also my introduction to K Dot, to Kendrick with section 80. Yeah, like that stays with me. I don't I don't care what I love all the music he puts out, nothing for me, top section 80. Yeah, section 80 is like a pinnacle.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:04

I like that. Yeah, which one of these three would have understood the version of you that was still changing pronouns in her own songs?

SPEAKER_02 1:21:16

I had to look too like that's that's rough. Wow. Um I wanna say in the current form, probably Kendrick, but I also think um not now, my boy.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:42

Right, not now, baby.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:46

No, you good. Okay, I'm about to be done.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:50

All right, okay, okay. No, you good, you good? Which one of these three would have understood the version of you that was still changing pronouns in her songs?

SPEAKER_02 1:22:02

Um, wow, um hell of a question. Uh um that was still change your pronouns. Uh I mean, I think probably maybe Ella. Maybe Ella. Maybe Ella. I feel like, okay, I feel like only because during her heyday, you know, the the girls were doing the things. They were doing the things. Now they weren't out and about with it, of course. At least not everywhere, but they were still doing the things. Like she still came up around 1920s, yeah, right. Like that era, right? And like the girls was was fucking on the girls. They was so like, yeah, she might understand. She might have seen some peeped. Okay, peeped is you know what I'm saying. We see each other. Okay. And so and been like, oh, okay, I see why you're changing the pronouns on them songs, girl.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:58

Yeah, like it's okay. It's okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:00

Come on, see, it's we see it's safe. Come over, come over to Auntie House. Let's talk.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:06

Let me see. All right. We ain't gonna cook you no more.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:11

Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:11

You good. That was great. You took it. Thank you, thank you. How are you feeling, Neil? Thank you. I did it. I did it. I feel good. Thank you. You got through it. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:19

Thank you. I appreciate you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:21

Neil, from here, when you about to leave this chair, right? Uh-huh. Right, you're gonna leave this yellow chair. Yeah, and then when you go back home, don't forget about this interview, right? Okay, don't forget about this interview and don't remember. I mean, I said don't remember, don't forget. Right, right? Who are a sweetheart ever? Ever, ever. Okay. Like never, never. I would over 100K, your voice getting better. You're about to go hit the home steel. Okay. Okay. Every day. You're about to release some music. Okay. Period. And with that being said, like, how do you feel now? And that you in the spot. If God was like, you know what? That's it. How do you feel?

SPEAKER_02 1:24:12

I feel vindicated. I always knew. That's a great word, vindicated. Yeah. I knew that it was gonna take some muscle to start getting to these places and these points. And I knew that I had at least the groundwork to start getting there. There were folks around who didn't. But I think the path that I'm on now allows me to like feel some vindication. Like, oh no, I was doing it right. And I I gotta be thankful for that. So thankful. You know, feel grateful. You know what I'm saying? Feel it, feel it in your bones. Okay, period.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:56

I wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here. Thank you for having me. This was fun. We gotta do this again. Of course. Yes. Yes. I would love to have you on. Again. Yes. As you know, I don't shoot once, I shoot twice. Okay, period.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:08

Okay, outside. Okay. Okay, period.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:11

And we ain't gonna go nowhere yet.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:14

Let them know where they can follow you. Okay. So follow me everywhere. Okay, all the things. Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, Christian Mingle, Black People Meet. Come on. Um, all the things. Tinder, swipe right. Um, no. Um, J A C Q C O N Music, Jackcom Music on everything. Um, follow my fan page, jackcommusic.com. Come on. We got things coming. Sign up for my newsletter. We got so many things coming down the pipe, and I'm so excited about all of the things: new shows, new music, new concerts, all of it. So follow me there, sign up for my newsletter, hit me up, I'm around.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:52

Y'all already know it's your girl Kenlo back, get it again. You know where to find me, the Ken Lo show. But before I go, because I told her not to go, but but you know, before I go, stay tuned because we got more coming from Jack, and I'll be back at it again soon.

SPEAKER_02 1:26:10

So, I'm here to provide a little insight, a little inside look into my new single called Slip Away. So, not to give too much tea. This is not tea time, okay? Put your cups away. But I was going through one of the most tumultuous breakups I've ever experienced. Ever. And when I say uh breakup, I'm not talking about a little do-to-do, we just not talking. I'm talking about some deep soul-crushing shit. Okay? And we decided to take a break. And in this break, I decided to write a song about how I was feeling in real time. And when I say this song is literally a snapshot of my experiences. So what you hear is absolutely real. What you hear is absolutely real life, and what you're hearing is absolutely true to what I was experiencing. So this is not a fairy tale, it's not just a little short story. It is something that actually happened to me. So when you listen, understand, feel it, internalize it, hear it, but love on it, and experience it. So I hope you enjoy it.